Kemper KPA vs. Axe-FX II (Yes, another one...please read!)

Wow, what a convoluted thread this has been. I'll refrain from raking up the past, but will ask, "Did you have fun, girls?"

I got to disagree with OP on a couple of things too. While the Kemper's effects may not be many, lousy they aren't, I just have to look at a few presets done by guys like Bill Ruppert, Paults and Meambobbo to underline that. Heck, even the presets I've made aren't too shabby. Perhaps things like delay and reverb are worse than on the Axe. But the pitch shifter and harmonizer on the Kemper are better and I daresay other effects too.

Also, you're monitoring on headphones? Not my ideal way to test out a device like the Kemper. Make sure you turn on headphone space. Pretty sure there will be improvements going forward too. I'll note that a lot of people aren't very happy with how the stomps are modelled, but I find them quite useable.

Profile those vintage stomps guys, it's

Quote from MuddyFox

Some folk have swapped the knobs out, some more visually appealing than others. One page that comes to mind is here
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=1443016

I have considered changing the knobs on mine a while back but that would just be cosmetic. The problem which I pointed out a while back in another thread was the stems are not solid at all on the potentiometers. Wiggle the knob side to side. A LOT of lateral movement.
I just bought a cheap chinese made ac to dc variable power supply for some of my electronic projects and the potentiometers are rock solid. No movement at all. I expected them to be more like what I see on the Kemper.

Guys, this thread and the one over at the Fractal forum is a marketing campaign, plain and simple. Our pal mbrown3 (who has been a Fractal forum member since 2008) has scheduled a side by side comparison of the two units with a member of the Fractal forum.
My bold prediction?
Our buddy mbrown3 will compare the factory rigs of the KPA to the AxeFX2 that has been optimized and state "while the KPA is a good unit, with the new Fractal firmware, the AFX2 has really surpassed the Kemper!! and the effects!!! ZOMG!!"

The Fractal forum will erupt with cheers, fist bumps, bro-hugs and collectively say, "I KNEW it!!"
(I also predict that there will be no video of the comparison)

Inthrutheout: I know what you mean.
While I agree that rotaries and encoders have a different construction than regular pots and could by design be "looser", there shouldn't be a wide discrepancy between the encoders themselves. My "type" knob is as wobbly as they come while my "browse" knob is almost too stiff. A far cry from "german engineering" for sure but hey, I'm so thrilled with what's coming out of the toaster that I really don't mind!

Something is not Kosher around here...

Quote from Khaki_Lackey

Guys, this thread and the one over at the Fractal forum is a marketing campaign, plain and simple. Our pal mbrown3 (who has been a Fractal forum member since 2008) has scheduled a side by side comparison of the two units with a member of the Fractal forum.
My bold prediction?
Our buddy mbrown3 will compare the factory rigs of the KPA to the AxeFX2 that has been optimized and state "while the KPA is a good unit, with the new Fractal firmware, the AFX2 has really surpassed the Kemper!! and the effects!!! ZOMG!!"

The Fractal forum will erupt with cheers, fist bumps, bro-hugs and collectively say, "I KNEW it!!"
(I also predict that there will be no video of the comparison)

Quote from Guitartone

Something is not Kosher around here...

I said that a while back. Maybe not as quietly as you but....

mbrown

First of all, NEVER do a review on day one, always wait a day or two until you've spent a few hours on day one and day two playing on the unit.

The Clean Factory Profiles that you say sound "lifeless and dead"...keep in mind, they were Profiles done in 2011 in Nashville.
They are pure Profiles, no tweaks no nothing.

Don't be fooled by "Volume"....they might sound "weak and lifeless" at low volume.
Turn them up to gig volume or even loud in the studio volume and they won't sound weak and lifeless any more.

I like a Compressor upfront on almost all Clean Profiles.
Go to Stomp A and add the Compressor stomp.
Turn the "Intensity" to around 4.5 or slightly less.
Now how do the Clean Profiles sound, even at low volume?

maybe so, but there are still good points in this thread - the KPA is not a perfect unit (but close to one IMO...at least for my desires).

and if one person A/B's the units and concludes he likes the Axe better, who cares? There are lots of people who have the opposite opinion, and some who think both units are great. so if it is a marketing campaign, it seems like a stupid one IMO. I'll give Mbrown the benefit of the doubt.

I kind of agree about the reverbs - the ambient one in particular is hard to listen to in headphones when you don't have significant other effects going on - there's a clear echo/modulation pattern that seems way too obvious - it sounds artificial, not like a cave. however i really like the Hall reverb, and the rooms are pretty good too. You need to play with the Dampening parameter to get more natural sounds in some cases.

You won't get any mileage from the delays without messing with the tone controls. On its own, it's a straight digital delay - I'm not sure what people expect... Even the analog delay is straight digital - the "analog" portion comes from pitch shifted delays when changing delay time. With over 90% feedback, it does do some tape saturation effects but they're relatively subtle.

IMO all cleans are somewhat lifeless, until you add chorus or reverb to them. The KPA profiling process removes "the room", so the resulting profile is VERY dry, even compared to the mic'ed signal without any reverb effects.

You can definitely nitpick every product put out in the world. There is no perfect product "period". But one thing is for sure, it is definitely not difficult to get some awesome sounding tones out of the KPA, without much tweaking "period"... And that's whether your pumping out to FRFR or Guitar cab.

Quote from meambobbo

IMO all cleans are somewhat lifeless, until you add chorus or reverb to them. The KPA profiling process removes "the room", so the resulting profile is VERY dry, even compared to the mic'ed signal without any reverb effects.

Yes, but if you are playing in a room, doesn't that reintroduce it?
Mind blown.

So far, I've played almost exclusively with headphones so I've had to give most of the profiles a little "nudge" anyways.

When introduced, headphone space option helped a bunch, though!

Quote from meambobbo

maybe so, but there are still good points in this thread - the KPA is not a perfect unit (but close to one IMO...at least for my desires).

and if one person A/B's the units and concludes he likes the Axe better, who cares? There are lots of people who have the opposite opinion, and some who think both units are great. so if it is a marketing campaign, it seems like a stupid one IMO. I'll give Mbrown the benefit of the doubt.

Ah, the voice of reason. Thank you.

Quote from Guitartone

Turn them up to gig volume

This is an absolute must when checking out modelers (or real amps, for that matter). Only then can you hear what's really hidden in there, good or bad.

Quote from Guitartone

I like a Compressor upfront on almost all Clean Profiles.
Go to Stomp A and add the Compressor stomp.
Turn the "Intensity" to around 4.5 or slightly less.
Now how do the Clean Profiles sound, even at low volume?

THIS IS IT!

Quote from Hallan

THIS IS IT!

Or rather, just use the Compressor parameter in the amp section. Works wonders.

Quote from meambobbo

so if it is a marketing campaign, it seems like a stupid one IMO. I'll give Mbrown the benefit of the doubt.

Look how many views this thread and that thread have gotten. Everyone that google searches ax2 versus Kemper is going to be directed to these threads. It's pretty damn clever marketing, actually.
They've accused him of being a Kemper operative in advance to counter the accusations to the contrary. Pretty well thought out.

Quote from Trazan

Guitartone wrote:
I like a Compressor upfront on almost all Clean Profiles.
Go to Stomp A and add the Compressor stomp.
Turn the "Intensity" to around 4.5 or slightly less.
Now how do the Clean Profiles sound, even at low volume?

THIS IS IT!

Or rather, just use the Compressor parameter in the amp section. Works wonders.

Display More

it´s different in amp section IMHO.. I use 99% on cleans compressor in front + a bit pure boost also

Oh I forgot to mention...

Take the headphones and hide them away in a cupboard where hopefully you'll forget where you hid them.
You cannot do a review (especially you first review on day one) of the Kemper based on the tones coming out of headphones...

Yikes!!!...playing an amp through headphones, come on guys get real.
Have you ever plugged headphones into a tube amp???

Headpnones are for when you decide to do some recording late at night and your kids and wife/GF are sleeping in the next room....

Quote from meambobbo

I kind of agree about the reverbs - the ambient one in particular is hard to listen to in headphones when you don't have significant other effects going on - there's a clear echo/modulation pattern that seems way too obvious - it sounds artificial, not like a cave.

The reverb's name is
"Ambience", as in 'subtle room effect',

not "Ambient", as in 'play three notes and let reverberate for 30 minutes'.

if you take a simulation with strong ERs like Ambience and crank the Time and Mix parameters, yup, it's gonna sound strange, since rooms of this size simply won't reverberate for this long.
it is however a pretty good approximation of a spring reverb tank.