Why do my profiles sound like arse?

    Ok so i've had the Kemper a little while now and for someone who loves real tube amps I think this is the tits! Great sound, very useful for many different things blah blah kemper is awesome :D

    Anyway i've just had my second attempt at trying to profile one of my heads and i got the same result as the first time i tried.... it sounds like arse! No really it sounds like the gain has been maxed out and it was recorded with the neck pickups and the tone pot on when it wasn't. I've followed the instruction manual, i've watched numerous tutorials online and i've tried some of my own ideas but still rubbish.

    So here is what I did and there are audio clips below for your scrutiny:

    - Set up my Peavey XXX into my Orange 2x12 and got the tone.
    - Then mic'ed it up with an SM57 and an e906 and got the mic sounds and preamp levels in Pro Tools sounds wicked.
    - Then I hooked up the Kemper as per the very simple instructions and completed the profiling process.
    - When comparing to the reference amp my tones sound like arse.
    - I did this with the following two signal chains but got the same results:

    1) Guitar into Kemper Input > Kemper DI Out into XXX > XXX into Cab > SM57 into Audient ASP008 > ASP008 output into Kemper Return > Kemper Main Out into PT via ASP008

    2) Guitar into Kemper Input > Kemper DI Out into XXX > XXX into Cab > SM57 into Kemper Return > Kemper Main Out into PT via ASP008

    Here are the results:
    Guitar directly into XXX > SM57 > ASP008 > PT
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/vzlkebmjn8yd6gy/XXX Amp SM57.mp3?dl=0

    Guitar into Kemper > Kemper profile of amp into Mesa 2x12 > SM57 > ASP008 > PT
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/0vebc6n2aw9pa9q/XXX Kemper Miced cab SM57.mp3?dl=0

    Guitar into Kemper > Kemper profile of amp > Kemper Main Out > PT
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/si2vcqx4y0l36ex/XXX Kemper Profile.mp3?dl=0

    I've tried this both at High Amp volumes and low amp volumes and get the same results, but all other profiles that i've downloaded sound wicked so i'm confused as to where i'm going wrong. ?(8|

    Any advice or ideas welcome, hopefully i've just missed something simple. Cheers!

    It sounds great, exactly like in the first clip I posted where you're just listening to the mic. I was just playing some more and turned the Clarity up to full which cleaned it up somewhat but you still hear fizzle and mud in the low end and it doesn't even come close to the reference amp.

    Yeah i saw that earlier.... flippin' dropbox, i've just checked the links and it looks like they've sorted themselves out! I'm not clipping the ASP008 for sure as it's got LED metering plus as shown in signal chain 2 i took the ASP008 out of the equation just to make sure and i get the same results.

    Quote from WarlockStudios

    Ok so i've had the Kemper a little while now and for someone who loves real tube amps I think this is the tits! Great sound, very useful for many different things blah blah kemper is awesome :D

    Anyway i've just had my second attempt at trying to profile one of my heads and i got the same result as the first time i tried.... it sounds like arse! No really it sounds like the gain has been maxed out and it was recorded with the neck pickups and the tone pot on when it wasn't. I've followed the instruction manual, i've watched numerous tutorials online and i've tried some of my own ideas but still rubbish.

    Any advice or ideas welcome, hopefully i've just missed something simple. Cheers!

    Hi Warlock,

    Indeed, as Don Petersen stated in previous post, it is quite possibly the built-in noise gate that is causing the problems in profiling your XXX.

    Please read this thread for solution (see link below). Warnng, the thread does derail towards the end, but it is kind of a funny read.

    Direct Out Profiling issues Peavey Triple XXX

    In any event, it appears you are not alone in having issues profiling your Peavey XXX.

    Good Luck,
    John

    Hey guys,

    Thanks for your input and ideas so far :) much appreciated. I had a quick blast through the thread but first off i'm using a first generation XXX head with no built in noisegate that's on the MK2 and i think also the JSX model so it rules that out. The first amp I tried to profile when I got my Kemper a few months ago was my Orange Dual Terror and I had the same results then! But I took your advice and went straight for my Mesa Dual Rectifier Road King and the results were that I was actually able to take a good profile! 8o

    The signal chain was:

    Guitar into Kemper > Kemp DI out to Mebo > Mebo to Orange 2x12 > Orange 2x12 to e906 > e906 to ASP008 > ASP008 to Kemp return

    Here is the Mic into PT:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/xvx3fbjobt3sbx4/Mesa e906.mp3?dl=0

    Here is the profile from the Kemp's main out:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/a281mrf2or8acru/Mesa Kemper Profile.mp3?dl=0

    I wasn't too bothered about tone just testing that I got the clean profile but it's not too shabby tbh so i've uploaded it to the Rig Exchange and it can be found as: Warlock-FatKing

    Next I went to try out my Orange Dual Terror and unfortunately got the same results as the XXX. At this stage i'm thinking maybe it is just too hot of a level for the Kemp.... but; I turned the gain on the preamp right down so it was barely tickling and tried setting different return levels on the kemp too. It was slightly better but still not as clean as the Mebo. There's still that squelchy fuzzy low end, turning up the clarity does improve slightly but also compromises the tone I find.

    (Same signal chain different amp)

    Dual Terror 1:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/btjfnhfbzhnrtbx/Dual Terror 1.mp3?dl=0

    Dual Terror 2:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/cdnmgl1dw0a6fos/Dual Terror 2.mp3?dl=0

    Dual Terror 3 with clarity knob engaged:
    https://www.dropbox.com/s/nqviqfa8iqso7ra/Dual Terror 3 clarity.mp3?dl=0

    I find it a bit bizarre that one amp is fine and the others are having these results but I guess that is just the nature of profiling?

    Not in my experience. Generally, whatever you put in is what you get out (or 98% of the way there at least). I've had problems where certain amps or preamps have had a clipping diode somewhere in the chain that the KPA for some reason can't replicate 100%, but for 90% of the tube amps out there, it works pretty perfectly.

    There must be something amiss somewhere.

    Quote from WarlockStudios

    Hey guys,

    Thanks for your input and ideas so far :) much appreciated. I had a quick blast through the thread but first off i'm using a first generation XXX head with no built in noisegate that's on the MK2 and i think also the JSX model so it rules that out.

    I find it a bit bizarre that one amp is fine and the others are having these results but I guess that is just the nature of profiling?

    Not sure if this may still be of interest...however, according to the Peavey forum, even the very first generation Peavey Triple X (XXX) had internal, "built-in" noise reduction circuitry. It wasn't adjustable, and had no indication or controls on the external chassis. Here is a quote from the Peavey Forums on this topic:

    Quote

    Re: Peavey Triple XXX Noise Gate - all version?
    Postby M-III » Mon Aug 24, 2015 1:13 pm

    Technically, there is no noise gate on this amp, it's at best "noise reduction circuitry" and it's only on the crunch and ultra channels. All versions of the Triple XXX and even the newest 3120 amps have it as part of it's circuitry's signal path, even the old JSX and newest Triple XXX II have it but it's adjustable and actually called a "noise gate". The "noise gates" are but merely diodes in the circuitry of the crunch and ultra channels that eliminate most of the background noise and amp hum present on most high gain amps, unlike the 5150/6505 series amps that have none.(and are quite noisy even when not playing with lots of gain dialed in!) Again, they are not true noise gates though mind you, they will not cut off the signal beyond a certain threshold, they only eliminate low level amp hum and background noise. Anything beyond that and you'll probably want a real noise gate pedal or rack unit IMHO, like the ISP Decimator.

    Now if you are having what you feel are abnormal amounts of noise from the amp, I'd check out your guitar's electronics and shielding, your pedals and their power sources(power bricks near cables and speakers can introduce hum and noise into your signal) and also the amp's preamp and even power amp tubes for microphonics,(squealing feedback or excessive hum) a sign they are going bad.

    Anyway, hope this helps, good luck! 8)

    So, it is possible that this "noise reduction" circuitry, which is enabled automatically on the Crunch and Ultra channels, might be the culprit, here.

    Disclaimer -- I haven't looked at a circuit diagram of a 1st gen Triple XXX...so I am taking this post by "M-III" at face value (i.e., is true and accurate). Interestingly, it appears the question on the Peavey Forum was generated by "Sinmix", one of our own....a well known KPA owner and forum member. Here is the direct link to the topic/thread on the Peavey Forum:

    http://peavey.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=40987


    Cheers,
    John

    Edit -- P.S., thanks for sharing your profile!

    Edited once, last by Tritium (December 9, 2015 at 3:04 PM).

    Well blow me! Shows what I know, cheers for showing me that Tritium :) I also own a 3120 and i haven't got around to profiling that yet so i'm gonna give it a go and see what happens. I've got a few SinMix profiles and they're wicked so hopefully he will be along soon to let us know about that mod hahaha!

    I'm going to have a look around for extra info on the dual terror but the KPA did at one point say that it detected a noisegate when profiling the DT so maybe there's something similar going on there....?

    Edit: didn't take too long haha http://music-electronics-forum.com/t22602/

    @WarlockStudios Man Thx You Thx You!!!! :thumbup: really!! now we have 2 "idiots" "noobs" etc... on the forum You and Me :D

    Please read this post (ALL!!!) : Direct Out Profiling issues Peavey Triple XXX

    Fast Solution Below! And Yes its works!

    Stay Metal!

    Warlock,

    Please be advised that English is not Sinmix's primary language. So some of his comments and humor may not come across precisely as he intends. He means well, and is a righteous dude. :thumbup:

    EDIT -- Woops, looks like he has already edited and improved his original post. Good catch, Sinmix.