[Public Beta] PROFILER OS 8.0.0.21450

Quote from Atlantic

Ok. So some noise was coming from a wireless system that I have in place.

Now, once I connect my guitar straight to the input I get the same noise level as if I just disconnect it completely.

Still in this situation I can make the KD hiss by increasing the drive and volume parameters (no cord connected to input). This hiss gets blocked by the Input Section Noise Gate if use it. Also I can block it with a Noise Gate stomp in front of the KD or after it. Please confirm that this behavior is normal.

This is normal.

Quote from jperttu

I mean that Kemper Drive is not Precision Drive. Does it sound 100% like Precision Drive? I don't actually care. I can do that and more with Kemper Drive and more importantly, I can dial my sound with it. For me, that' what matters.

The latter is the cruical point, for sure!

However, we have created the "Horizon Attack" presets for typical sweetspots, that are exactly on the point.

The Horizon, and the Timmy for the opposite side, were important corner points for us to define the range and character of the Definition control.

Quote from Atlantic

I'll have to go back and test again with the Maxon OD. But I was not able to get rid of enough clean signal to match the sound of the Maxon OD-9.

So I am assuming that you run your Maxon with Drive at zero, which is a typical sweet spot.

The corresponding KD Drive is 2.5, as the KD Drive has a wider span.

Try it out.

We will add a preset "808 Min" with Drive at 2.5.

Thanks for your input!

Quote from jperttu

I mean that Kemper Drive is not Precision Drive. Does it sound 100% like Precision Drive? I don't actually care. I can do that and more with Kemper Drive and more importantly, I can dial my sound with it. For me, that' what matters.

Thus said, my hat goes off for those who are currently A/B'ing and tweaking their pedals and Kemper Drive. That is what R/D is all about and that keeps Kemper still improving, after all these years. My best guitar related purchase ever, hands down. I've been Kemper owner since 2013 and every year I have found better profiles, better little tweaks and my guitar tone has improved. Even to the point I don't actually need better guitar tone, finally I can focus just to playing and recording my stuff.

-Jari

AMEN,,, agree 100%

Quote from ckemper

Nice measurements!

However, it does not contradict our approach and what we claim.

Hello M Kemper , I also watched Nighlight great vid & curves :

while I really dig the amount of controls , would it be possible to add a bass & hi shift ( like in the cab settings ) knob on the KD ?

it wouldn't contradict your approach , even if hi shift would be a bit redundant with tone control but let's say one knob controls the frequency while the other , the amount of dB boost/reducing ?

I'm more a natural drive vs pedals , but I still use a BB clone and some fuzzes in front of my KPA, didn't found the right settings on the KD yet.

Thanks for getting the direct feedback from the beta testers .

Finally got around to play around with the presets. Trying out the different Precision drive presets and the workflow doesn't really work that good I think. Mainly because the volume parameter is so important, and there is no way to lock the volume while trying different presets. So you end up selecting one preset, turn the volume to 2.5db, then try the next one, turn the volume up again etc. Not very intuitive.

Once I realized that the only difference between the presets is the definition control, the presets become obsolete. You just set the volume to 2.5 and mess with the definition. So it seems the attack knob in the precision drive is identical to the definition in the KD. Would be interesting to see if they actually behave in the same way.

Got to play around with the volume behavior of the drives as well. I know this has probably been discussed to death, but I found this behaving not as I expected as well. Check out this video:

The input led is not clipping. There is a substantial volume boost around 0, but the sound is almost identical in timbre and volume a -5 and 5. This goes for the green scream as well, so it's probably not new. Clean sense is a 0 db.

ckemper happy to share a backup if this is relevant? Is this the expected behavior?

I'm playing a pre-input-loop in the video, found the same thing while playing live.

Quote from musicmad

Finally got around to play around with the presets. Trying out the different Precision drive presets and the workflow doesn't really work that good I think. Mainly because the volume parameter is so important, and there is no way to lock the volume while trying different presets. So you end up selecting one preset, turn the volume to 2.5db, then try the next one, turn the volume up again etc. Not very intuitive.

Once I realized that the only difference between the presets is the definition control, the presets become obsolete. You just set the volume to 2.5 and mess with the definition. So it seems the attack knob in the precision drive is identical to the definition in the KD. Would be interesting to see if they actually behave in the same way.

This is truly the story the presets want to tell you, and you have seen the trick.

The improvement over the Horizon is, that the "Attack" functionality is continuously variable by the Definition control.

After you have found a sweet spot, try some "Slim Down" to intensify the tightening and focussing.

Actually the Volume control is not that important.

You can do the same effect by rising the amp gain.

Quote from waraba

Hello M Kemper , I also watched Nighlight great vid & curves :

while I really dig the amount of controls , would it be possible to add a bass & hi shift ( like in the cab settings ) knob on the KD ?

it wouldn't contradict your approach , even if hi shift would be a bit redundant with tone control but let's say one knob controls the frequency while the other , the amount of dB boost/reducing ?

I'm more a natural drive vs pedals , but I still use a BB clone and some fuzzes in front of my KPA, didn't found the right settings on the KD yet.

Thanks for getting the direct feedback from the beta testers .

I don't want to add more controls to the KD.

You have your AMP equalizer (tonestack) available still?

Quote from ckemper

This is truly the story the presets want to tell you, and you have seen the trick.

The improvement over the Horizon is, that the "Attack" functionality is continuously variable by the Definition control.

After you have found a sweet spot, try some "Slim Down" to intensify the tightening and focussing.

Actually the Volume control is not that important.

You can do the same effect by rising the amp gain.

Got it. Thanks for the reply

Did you see my video above as well?

Quote from lightbox

It CAN have a mid bump if it's set completely "the wrong way". But you'll not find any serious pro musician and Klon Centaur owner who would do that. One more time ... Volume is key and then a very careful use of Gain and Treble. If you do it that way, you'll experience the beautiful low end and slight low mids push for that warm but still wonderfully open and "true" sound. True to the guitar AND the amp used.

Personally, I absolutely hate Tubescreamers with a passion because they cut the legs and arms of a good guitar sound. Reminds me of the black knight in Monty Python's holy grail. But that's certainly personal taste.

lightbox

Your have made a lot of efforts to advertise the Klon for a use purely as a clean boost and masking all other sound options.

But isn't there more to the story?

I think this approach does not really keep up with the intentions of Bill Finnegan who tried to create a very flexible analog overdrive pedal.

You obviously confuse your fellow users by claiming that a Klon is set "the wrong way", when it has a mid bump.

I know some remarkable guitarists utilizing higher drive settings and taking advantage from the emphasized mid bump.

This has inspired me to create the "Slim Down" function, that is exclusively used in the Klon presets.

Quote from lightbox

How on earth is it possible that after this long of a thread you suggest this? I really wonder.

Would you suggest that when someone wants to kick in an additional boost, he should sacrifice the Morph function to switch the amp gain up/down? Or would you rather have the artist stop playing, turn around or kneel down to move the amp gain knob on the Profiler? C'mon, seriously.

The conversation was about the workflow of checking different presets, while maintaining the same level of amp distortion.

Not the final use in a performance.

Also be aware that the Horizon is often used (and even targeted) for Metal and Djent to tighten an already distorting amp, rather than boosting its distortion.

@musicmad's genre is not your genre, I guess.

It seems that you have an agenda of teaching everyone here your way of using an OD the way you prefer.

But there is different approaches to use an OD.

Quote from musicmad

Got to play around with the volume behavior of the drives as well. I know this has probably been discussed to death, but I found this behaving not as I expected as well. Check out this video:

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The input led is not clipping. There is a substantial volume boost around 0, but the sound is almost identical in timbre and volume a -5 and 5. This goes for the green scream as well, so it's probably not new. Clean sense is a 0 db.

ckemper happy to share a backup if this is relevant? Is this the expected behavior?

I'm playing a pre-input-loop in the video, found the same thing while playing live.

I think I know what it is, and it always has been there.

The Profiler has something like a soft fuse, when too much overall gain and amplification is used.

In this case the overall amplification is reduced.

Too much of this can cause electrical feedback just by bleeding high energy radiation back into.

The fuse treshold is 80 dB of pure amplification, or in other words, a 10000 fold amplification.

Since your AMP is set to a fairly low gain, I assume that there is other effect modules where the volume parameter dictates an amplification.

Quote from ckemper

I think I know what it is, and it always has been there.

The Profiler has something like a soft fuse, when too much overall gain and amplification is used.

In this case the overall amplification is reduced.

Too much of this can cause electrical feedback just by bleeding high energy radiation back into.

The fuse treshold is 80 dB of pure amplification, or in other words, a 10000 fold amplification.

Since your AMP is set to a fairly low gain, I assume that there is other effect modules where the volume parameter dictates an amplification.

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I only have the delay module on, and it doesn't change anything if I turn that off. Tried turning off amp, eq, and cab as well. The phenomenon only appears when the amp section is on. But I don't boost (amp volume for instance) anything there. What does that tell you?

Digging a bit more into this (sorry if I'm rehashing - just let me know) I tried playing around with clean sense. Unless I'm going crazy I used to be able to use clean sense to balance no (low) gain sounds with high gain sounds:

Right now it doesn't seem to make a difference. I would have sworn it used to?

Quote from musicmad

Digging a bit more into this (sorry if I'm rehashing - just let me know) I tried playing around with clean sense. Unless I'm going crazy I used to be able to use clean sense to balance no (low) gain sounds with high gain sounds:

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Right now it doesn't seem to make a difference. I would have sworn it used to?

musicmad is seems to me that you are reamping, are you???

If that is the case I made the same mistake some days ago. Clean Sens does nothing on the reamping circuit. You have to use output volume of your DI from the DAW and also Reamp Sens.

From the 7.5 manual:

Quote from Main Manual 7.5

 Step four: reamping input leveling
For an optimum signal-to-noise ratio, leveling the reamping input is just as critical as leveling the pure instrument
output. The leveling is done by the output level of the recording device; it cannot be adjusted in the PROFILER. The
S/PDIF signal can only be adjusted in the sending device by definition.
Instrument Input and Reamping 125
Play your guitar through the armed track or play back a previously recorded track. Watch the INPUT LED while you
adjust the output volume on the recording device. The LED should turn to yellow when the strings are struck hard,
but no further. This is all you need to do, so long as the Rig you are reamping has no distorting amp or effect in the
signal flow.
If you reamp a distorting Rig, you might notice that the amount of distortion still differs from the original, despite
following the above procedure. This is a natural consequence of the correct leveling of input and output: the leveling
is made to achieve an optimum signal-to-noise ratio but does not deal with the preservation of the original instrument
level. This is what the parameter “Reamp Sens” is for - simply dial the desired amount of distortion via ”Reamp
Sens” - and you’re all set!

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Quote from Atlantic

musicmad is seems to me that you are reamping, are you???

If that is the case I made the same mistake some days ago. Clean Sens does nothing on the reamping circuit. You have to use output volume of your DI from the DAW and also Reamp Sens.

From the 7.5 manual:

No I'm not. Using the looper pre-input. But thanks for the suggestion. It's the same result if I play guitar live btw. So my question is still valid.

Quote from musicmad

I only have the delay module on, and it doesn't change anything if I turn that off. Tried turning off amp, eq, and cab as well. The phenomenon only appears when the amp section is on. But I don't boost (amp volume for instance) anything there. What does that tell you?

Ahh, I see that you use the Full OC in the video.

I thought it was about the KD.

This is actually the volume stall some others have reported as well.

The volume compensation of the amp also compensates the distortion pedal, when the distortion volume is set to lower levels.

It has always been like that, I can see that this is disturbing.

I can think of ways to avoid the amps volume compensation, when driven by a pedal, while it can stay when not driven by a pedal.

Maybe we can change that for the next update, without causing volume differences on already existing rigs.