Posts by MattUlbricht

I just found out something that might clarify things (or make it even more complicated):

When "DI high" is used via the Kemper's "Direct Output", then - on output page 2/10 - the Direct Volume setting is activated. In my case, this level was reduced way down to -18.4dB for some reason. Consequently the corresponding signal level was really low and even lower than it is the case with "DI analog" and "DI low". When I set Direct Volume to 0dB the three DI-levels compare as they are supposed to: Then DI high is higher than DI analog and DI low. When Direct Output is set to DI analog or DI low, the Direct Volume Setting is greyed out, which makes sense, because these DI outputs produce unaffected instrument levels. But...

The thing ist, that in every recording session I encountered so far, the Kemper's Main Output level via XLR was quite high - for example: In my HomeStudio I had to set it to -15.1dB, on my bandmate's interface I even need to activate "Main Out -12dB" additionally. But this does not affect the levels of "DI analog" and "DI low". They remain comparatively "hot as f***" up to a degree that they could clip, when I set the interface's input gain level just the same as for the Master Signal.

To sum it all up, recording a DI signal is not as easy as it seems, because a level which is produced by an instrument or the kemper can be recorded at "any" level, depending on the input gain of the interface.

I guess, my remaining questions are:

1. How should I set the DI-level for recording?

It is easy for the master signal: Just below clipping. Should I do the same for the DI signal independently even though this might result in different input gain levels on the interface?

2. And should I record DI analog or DI low or DI high for future reamping via the Kemper? I have read the manual severel times but I still don't get it. I find different answers or at least no clear one to this:

DI analog: "Useful for reamping or running a second amp in parallel." (see p. 125)

DI high: "Thus, no separate DI box is needed to record the pure instrument for reamping purposes." (see p. 125)

3. Which DI signal is best suited for the use of plugins?

Thanks for your reply.

I currently use OS version 10.1.2.47971 with my Powered Profiler Head.

My Interface only has two inputs, so I had to make three seperate recordings in order to compare all three DI-tracks. Of course, the interface's input gain levels were left unchanged when switching between different DI outputs on the Kemper. On the Kemper I use the front input.

For every turn, I recorded two signals simultaneously: Master Mono via the Kemper's Main Output into interface input 1 and one of the DI signals via Direct Output into interface input 2. Both connected via quarter inch mono. At first, I had my regular XLR-connection running for the main output but the Direct Output Signal requires a quarter inch mono connection, which produced a noticeably reduced level somehow. In order to have both outputs at an equal level, I switched to quarter inch mono for both.

I chose the same input gain levels for both interface inputs, i. e. main signal and DI signal. As I wanted to rule out issues with the interface's input channels I switched back and forth between which input was used for the main signal vs. the DI signal. There were no level changes at all, so I think, my interface is working properly. I switched cables, too. I attached a screenshot from my DAW, which clearly shows the different DI levels.

I am having trouble with the levels of the three DI-Outputs "analog", "low" and "high". (formerly known as "Git analog", "Git+Processing" and "Git Studio") From the manual I understand that DI high should produce a higher output level as it creates a DI-Signal at studio level. That should be a lot higher than the instrument levels of "DI-analog" and "DI-low", shouldn't it?

That's not the case for me though. "DI-analog" and "DI-low" have significantly higher levels than "DI high", when I record all of them in my DAW via a USB-Audio-Interface. That seems strange to me and I don't understand why it is like that.

Up until today I thought, when recording with the kemper, recording one track for "DI low" was the way to go for later reamping. Is that still correct? I am confused, as the level seems to be way to high for an instrument level.

Am I missing something?

Quote from Wheresthedug

It works that way by design and is highly unlikely to change. The reason being that the Generic Gain covers the full range that the Kemper is capable of. Amp gain is almost always less than the full Kemper gain range. Linking the morph function to Amp Gain would restrict the morphable range unnecessarily. Within the amp’s gain range the two ate linked 1:1 so there is no reason to use the amp gain when the full range of the generic gain could be used.

While understanding what you are saying I still think that the restriction of allowing only the generic gain to be adjusted directly via morphing is unnecessary from a UI point of view. After all, with LP it is the amp gain you adjust just as you would do with a real amp. With LP you can forget about generic gain, so to say, because it doesn't matter anymore to the way you interact with the amp. The 1:1 link between amp gain and generic gain doesn't contradict the use of amp gain in morphing. Whenever you change either generic or amp gain the other gain's value changes immediately, corresponding to the tonestack model. So why should only the generic gain be usable for morphing? E. g. turning up the amp gain to 9.5 means that this is what I want. Of course, I can look up the corresponding value for generic gain and use this for morphing instead, but this remains a quirky workaround nonetheless and I don't see any reason for this limitation. With LP you wouldn't want to go beyond maximum amp gain just because generic gain would allow you to, right? If anyone wants exactly that, then that would be the weird use which could be accessible via a quirky workaround - not morphing the one gain knob you actually use every day.

Quote from Delinquent

Your not the first to make this observation, apparently it will only work with the generic gain.

Okay... thanks for the info. Maybe it will be implemented with an update in the near future. We'll see.

I just installed the new OS version 10.1.2.47971 with Liquid Profiling (no beta) and I am really happy with it so far. OT: Go grab the SLO100 by Bert Meulendijk. Seems to be a no-brainer to me!

One of the key features I had hoped to see was the realistic behaviour of the gain knob and as far as I can see (well, I am short sighted - but anyways...) Kemper delivers! One thing I cannot get to work properly though is morphing. I want to control to different settings of the gain knob via morphing and the gain knob seems to be "unmorphable". As a workaround it is possible to use morphing in order to control the generic gain which directly influences the dialed in setting for the amp's gain knob, but... well it seems a bit unnecessary to me or am I missing something?

Can anyone confirm my observation? Maybe there is a setting which makes the gain knob accessible to morphing?

Quote from lbieber

I don't think anyone outside of Kemper knows the answer to this. Based on what CK said, nothing is clear regarding the gain knob other than it will be able to model a bright cap.

Fortunately, that last statement is untrue. CK states exactly that the gain knob will behave like a real gain knob. (see HW's Video on YouTube, min. 7:15) But then again, what else should he say, seen from a marketing point of view...

Quote from christianbad

a minimum of good tweaking option?

maybe you missed to try out definition, compression, pick, clarity, etc in the amp section?

or the cab section with high and low shift, pure cabinet, imprints...

Of course I didn't! I think we all agree that we have long past the point of option paralysis and that the options you just gave are phenomenal.

That's why I explicitly referred to the "options given by the knobs on the kemper's front" which (by their name - not by their behaviour) replicate the ones found on a real amp. And that's the tweaking options you have at hand quickly when in a band setting - just as you would with a real amp. And these are the knobs many of us want to react in a realistic way without destroying your tone while staying close to the profiled amp - even when you turn them a fair bit. In such situations - i. e. during rehearsal or a gig - there is simply no time for the guitarist to deep-dive into menus or - as I described - for searching and trying out other profiles. There you want the knobs to do what they say in a satisfying way cause that's all you may need.

And of course your're right in pointing out that definition etc. exist and are another way of tweaking a profile. But to be honest, those aren't the ones I like to fiddle with when all I want is to go from really bright to dark or cleanish to really dirty. In these scenarios I want my kemper amp to act as an amp: quick and self explanatory by turning the knobs we all know by heart.

I sense a misunderstanding in some people's understanding of the mere greatness at reach here:

Some say that for them liquid profiles aren't a big thing, because they never had the original amps of their profiles at hand anyway and therefore don't know how all the knos in gain control and tone stack would react. As a consequence some say they're fine with the kemper controls. BUT I am afraid these people are missing out on the biggest point here:

As of now, i.e. without liquid profiles, you're basically stuck with your profile's sound "as is" with only a minimum of good tweaking options by changing gain an basic eq controls on the front of the kemper for the tiniest bit. The kemper's gain control, bass, mids, treble, presence are software based guesses of how a knob should work. By experience of many they are barely useable in all cases where you turn them more than "2-3 leds" (toaster) to the left or right. This noticeably changes the sound into the realm of "unrealistic", in some cases "not enjoyable". If you turn the knobs really far you can even create immensely weird noises within your guitar sound that have nothing to do with what any real amp in the world would do. THAT is the reason why all good profile packs give you loads of profiles for one single amp, sometimes the only difference being different gain levels. In short: A clean profile is unuseable for (higher) gain, a really dark profile cannot realistically be brightened up with the front controls (as both require big knob turns) and so forth.

Liquid profiles as they are described by CK overcome this flaw and make the knobs react as an amp. So - IF this dream comes true - one (ore a few drastically different) profiles should be enough. From there you can do everything you want with the kemper's knobs and still have it react as an amp would.

Many times at band rehearsal I have hated the discribed limitations whenever I wanted "the very amp" of a profile to have "much more gain" or "much less treble" and so on. On a real amp you just turn a knob and are good to go. Not so in the kemper world: Having to look for and switch to another profile of the same amp, only to find out that it's not yet "the one", has always been the major bummer in using a kemper and it has made day-to-day-use somewhat unsatisfying. Putting this to an end with THE SAME hardware AT NO COST is THE game changer! If it all works as we hope for than we basically get a new device for free.

Super, vielen Dank! Einmal verstanden wann und wie der Kemper das macht, ergibt das tatsächlich Sinn!

Hallo,

ich habe das Problem, dass der Kemper - für mich nach nicht nachvollziehbarem Muster - "manchmal" Änderungen an meinen Performances einfach speichert, obwohl ich nicht die "STORE"-Taste betätigt habe. Beispielsweise ist dann beim Neustart plötzlich in einem Performance-Slot der Booster aktiv, obwohl ich das so nicht gespeichert habe. Besonders toll ist das nicht, wenn man bei der Probe eben nicht die erwarteten Sounds aufruft, sondern plötzlich alles anders ist.

Kennt jemand das Problem? Wie kann ich das verhindern? Oder gibt es dahinter eine Logik, die ich nur nicht verstehe und in Wahrheit ist das ganz genau so, wie es sein soll?

Für jede Hilfe dankbar

Matze

It seems to me that I am experiencing similar problems when creating a direct amp profile of an EVH 5150III (which has obviously been DI profiled successfully a thousand times). I must say, that I'm quiet confident I took care of everything as suggested as I read almost all the info I could find on this forum and the web:

- Connections: Just as shown in the manual, guitar->Kemper->Kemper direct out->Amp Input->Amp Output->DI-Box (PAD -40dB)->XLR-out->Kemper return Input, + DI-Box->Cabinet
- All cables are okay, DI-Box (passive) new and without any Cabsims
- All FX (stomps and post stack) switched off
- clean sense low enough so that the input LED remains green all the time
- return level low enough so that the Output LED remains green, too (tried many different levels, though)
- DI-Box is the admittetly cheap Millenium DI-E from thomann, but it was sold 998 times, 4.4 out of 5 stars... well...

Every time the result is a sound with too much rumbling in the bass which simply doesn't exist in the reference amp. Strangely, when comparing the dry Kemper-DI-profile (without cab) to the reference-amp-output-signal (again without cab) there was a significant difference: The bass rumbling only occured on the Kemper-DI-profile. The reference amp, eventhough monitored through (!) the cheap DI-Box, sounded as it should. (That's why I hopefully can eliminate the DI-Box as a source of the problems.) Well, we swapped the amp for another EVH and the results were better, but the rumbling remained at least audible. BUT here comes the even worse part:

The kemper's presence knob as well as the treble show some really strange behaviour when tweaking the DI-profile:
- dialing the presence up results in metallic/shrill and unharmonic overlapping sounds while even becoming kind of out of tune...? I cannot find such a behaviour in any other profiles I own nor on the reference amp itself.
- the same is true for treble, worst results occur when dialing up presence above 2 o'clock and treble at the same time. It just does not sound like something you would expect these knobs to do... well, not even a heavy metal guitar amplifier
(- less severe, but the same goes for the gain: the knob's behaviour is not reproduced accurately, the highest levels of gain seem digital and unpleasent)

Now, my questions:

What am I doing wrong? Is it possible that the KPA gets into trouble, when trying to reproduce higher values of any knob setting on the reference amp?
When profiling an amp, what settings should be used on the reference amp? Is it okay to dial in presence (or anything else) at 3 o'clock or should I use "flat" Settings at, let's say 12 o'clock? Or should "the perfect sound" be profiled "as is" in any case? Apart from clipping: Does the return level have any influence on the resulting profile? (The manual says that it doesn't, because the KPA adjusts the level anyways... but as of now it remains the only questionable part I can see, apart from the cheap DI-Box of course.)

Thanks a lot for any help!

Matthias