Posts by b_ryan

Quote from Ibot39

There will be no tonestack for your rare amp available, except it is in the small list currently available. You simple can not make a liquid profile of it.
Vendors offering boutique amps, rare and modded amps or simple the amps Kemper has no tone stacks yet, they can not make liquid profiles!

But aren’t many amps sharing the tonestack? I was under the impression, that this was true. And I don’t know if the list shown in T&T video 2 is a small list. Doesn’t it look like it’s been very much increased?

But let’s say, that your argument is true. And it might be of course. That still leaves the business in a very weak spot compared to now.

Quote from jub_100

I don’t think commercial profiling is dead. Many of us—including me—will never have access to rare or expensive amps, which is exactly why we choose something like a Kemper or a similar unit.

After seeing a snapshot of what the 2.0 update can do, it really just shows that any amp—whether it’s a Fender, Marshall, Vox, or something else—can be adjusted to suit your own tone. I see it as a starting point for finding your sound. That’s all it is and all it will ever be: a blank canvas. You bring the paint, and you shape it into whatever tone you’re chasing.

Maybe not dead dead. But, answer me this. I want a profile of a really rare amp from the 70’s or whatever. Once I have it, why should I buy another one from another seller? Or why should I buy yet another version of that same rare amp from the same seller? What will I ever gain from that?

Of course taken into account, that some have more than one channel, the whole jumpered thing etc. But, let’s say that it’s a regular 2-channel amp, that has a liquid profile.

Why should I buy yet another one now? I have the “exact” amp now. The amp I was looking for. All I now need is the speaker-solution. It’s like you have purchased the amp for real. Would you buy two? Why?

If you can separate profiling amp and cab and you have a liquid profile, then you only need an IR. You now have it like a Line 6 model. You have the whole thing. You don’t need different snapshots of different eq settings etc.

That’s what I mean by dead or doomed. I see no real business to be found here. Of course there will always be some, that either don’t know or whatever. There will also always be a very tiny market for reel-to-reel recording studios. Some do still like that, but it’s a minority. It’s not really a business, that thrives.

If you can get one profile - like a modelled one - and that profile is as close, as Kemper possibly can get, I cannot see a market for making profiles anymore. It’s obsolete. Maybe not 100% obsolete, but isn’t it stupid to buy the same thing over and over again, when it’s just the cab/mics that differ?

Quote from paddyc

many amps will have several settings to capture, eg. a bright cap, jumpered, jazz/rock switch etc.

Good point of course. But once that’s all been done one time, what then? That transcends the regular eq and gain settings of course.

Quote from paddyc

[…] Add to that different mics and combinations of mics ( consider the expense of something like a 121 - most people won't own one) so i think the professional guys will be fine. Also trying to "rertofit" an I.R. later on may not give the same Result

But, that’s the thing. The mics etc are not for the amp circuit. They are for the cab section of the rig/profile. So all that - to me - seems like it’s totally obsolete regarding buying anything else than just IR packs - or using the imprints. The amp itself is just the amp.

So if you want a profile of a specific amp and there is a Liquid profile of it. Why on earth would you want more than one? I really can’t see it. The circuit that is profiled should be the exact same on all versions of that particular amp. To me buying commercial rigs/profiles seems doomed.

Quote from JoePVblue

Liquid profiling will never have the same behaviour as the amp.

It’s more or less close, but not the same!

Yes, I get that. Call it a minor imperfection or something else. But, that minor imperfection between the programming of Liquid Profiling - and the end result of that - and then the actual amp, would have to be universal, right?

The amp makers makes amps, that should sound pretty similar if not completely similar. If taking 100 of the same amp, the company strive to make those 100 amps sound the same. The Liquid Profiling would sound the same on all of them, would then be my guess.

Quote from JoePVblue

if you want to have an exact snapshot you have to create snapshots.

Or you have to dial in the tone.

I’m not talking about snapshots. I’m talking about getting an amp to tweak to your liking. I’m talking about wanting the “real” amp with its eq-settings and gain-settings to be equal to the real amp - or very close to. If you have that, why would you ever want anything else? If it’s 98-99% close to the real amp? That makes all that snapshot chasing obsolete. You already have the amp. Now you just need the IR.

I asked a question in the 2.0 thread, but I guess, that it’s off topic. So I start a thread about it here.

Should buying commercial rigs and profiles be over?

A rig often just consists of the amp + the cab, mics and external gear. My logic says, that the profiling stage of the amp alone must be entirely the same every time.

Because, It’s the same amp. Because, the profiling process will profile the exact same circuit every time. The circuit doesn’t change.

If having 1 amp profiled on every channel (clean, crunch and lead) and the creator has made it a Liquid Profile, why would you ever need another profile of the same amp? As in ever again.

You can just swap out the cab for an IR or the Kone imprints.

If you then take another profile of the same amp, and then cut the cab from the rig, and then put in the same IR. You would have to get the same sound, right? Because, the amp circuit is the exact same as the one prior.

Why do we need to buy from commercial rig creators, now that Liquid Profiling exists?

What is the difference, when you cut away the cab from the different rigs of the same amp? I don’t get it. It should be the same. We should always get the “real” amp tone.

Quote from quemper

It sounds like you will need fewer variations of a given profile to handle varying needs. Maybe that will cut into how many profiles are sold across everyone ... or maybe it just means that a "pack" will just have one profile.

On the other hand, for many people today, one great 1.0 profile covers the bulk of their needs.

But isn’t the only thing of variation the microphone in front of the cab? The profiling would be the same for the amp? That leaves the exact same amp profile, if they do it the same way (all knobs at 12 o’clock as a Liquid Profile). All profiles will be the same, wouldn’t it? And how does 2.0 play a role? But maybe I’m wrong.

I wonder about, if it really just comes down to what cab/IR you use with the profile now.

And is it really a matter of 2.0? Isn’t it about the Liquid Profiling? And isn’t Liquid Profiling kinda erasing the need of more than one profile per amp channel?

Wouldn’t all profiles - of let’s say an Engl Powerball - on one single channel sound/be exactly the same as everyone else’s Engl Powerball, if using Liquid Profiling?

Isn’t it just the mics and cab, that is different? So if you switch that cab off and go IR or Kemper Kone imprints, then all Liquid Profiles of the Engl Powerball would be the same if they profiled it in neutral positions of the knobs?

Doesn’t that make buying profiles from creators obsolete? Isn’t it just IR’s that one needs to look at?

Or am I missing something? And is the 2.0 doing something different? I suddenly don’t see the need to buy profiles anymore.

Quote from waraba

Ain't that new cab feature just a resonance & cut off ? it's been on synth for more than 50 years ??

It doesn’t seem like it does the exact same thing. Maybe it’s just a downscaled version of these two knobs? Because it sure seems like a synth can create a lot more crazy “sweeps”.

Quote from musehead

[…] If you purchased the new device expecting some groundbreaking leap, you've simply fallen for the marketing.
If you paid for the MK2—which essentially offers nothing more than a different color and faster boot times […]

[…] They promoted it as if there was something revolutionary, but let's just acknowledge there wasn't.

I see some issues here. Other brands have done exactly this over the past year. So somehow expecting Kemper to not do the same - even though they told us, that this was coming - is the right way to go about it?

Can you elaborate on this claim, that 2.0 doesn’t exist? Even though content creators have hintet exactly this. Can you explain what Kemper would gain from this extensive lie?

I guess it depends on the terms groundbreaking leap and revolutionary. Do you consider the other brands versions of 2.0 revolutionary or groundbreaking leaps? Either way I expect 2.0 to be on the same level of evolution as the other brands version of 2.0. Call it revolutionary or a very tiny leap. Something has definitely changed according to people, that uses the competitors solutions.

So I’m curious about, what makes you think the way, you do. I’m not saying, that you’re not right. I just want to see some actual evidence instead of blabbering.

Synth effects would be awesome. No doubt about that. The triggering technology has changed a lot since my Axon AX100 MKii days with a MIDI piezo system on my Godin. It should be possible technology-wise.

Quote from tsachou

removed by mod

I interpret this as a sarcastic post, because I cannot imagine someone believing, that this is true in anyway.

Anything about 2.0 is speculation. One can hope/think, that they are working on something great, that will make the Kemper reclaim the trust from those, who seem to have lost it.

Quote from tamagotchi666

(Your question:The cab can be switched on/off in two places in the output page. Why:)

Cabinet profiles can be selectively bypassed only for the MONITOR OUTPUT. You might want it on one output but not on the other. This is only important if, for example, you want to send the sound to the mixing desk and to your monitor at the same time. It only comes into play when you are using two outputs.

But by now I’m a bit confused and hope I’m not talking nonsense

No worries.

One can also turn on/off the cab under the Kemper Kone setting: the last line at the bottom on the output page in RM.

Quote from where is christophe

Just set your Player’s Kone soft button to white to run in FRFR mode.

Red is imprint mode and orange is virtual cab off for running a guitar cab.

That must be a global choice, right? I would like to be able to for instance have a clean with imprints and high gain without imprints.

Quote from tamagotchi666

Sorry, you’re using the Player. The page numbers I mentioned refer to the manual for the Head, but everything is also well explained in the Player manual. If that doesn’t help you, I won’t bother looking up the exact page numbers for you.

Only this from the manual (Speaker Imprint mode): When ‘Monitor Cab Off’ is activated, the simulation of the cabinet profile is selectively bypassed for the MONITOR OUTPUT.”

But if it’s just about the punch and FRFR mode gets you the punch, just use FRFR.

Yeah, I kinda figured out, that you were referring to another manual

No, it’s more than just punch. There are many questions left unanswered. The cab can be switched on/off in two places in the output page. Why? How does the one affect the other? How does the Monitor Out (and the cab on/off and the Kone on/off) relate to the settings in the cabinet, where you can select imprints as well? How does these two settings possibilities affect each other? I think the manual leaves way too much unexplained. At least to me.

Quote from where is christophe

Not everything is about mix ready tone, when practicing some like a more fun and fuller tone.

It is perfectly possible to obtain that with the Kemper, propers IRs and EQ going into a Kone speaker.

The bass boost definitely helps with the punch and while the integrated OD and drive can do the job, I personally like an analog drive in front of the unit better.

No guarantee that it will work for you but, b_ryan if you want I can show you some of the rigs I use and how they are set up.

I take all the help, I can get Do you have a video on YouTube or something? Sure, it’s not about the mix ready tone. When using the powered kabinet (in stereo) it’s all about getting the punch (regarding high gain rigs), that studio monitors doesn’t give you. It’s about having a decent tone for playing with a drummer as well.

Quote from BayouTexan

I don't think your problem is the imprints. Extreme Metal tone inherently sounds weak, thin, and awful […]

That’s certainly one way of putting it

Quote from BayouTexan

[…] In order to make that type of metal tone somewhat pleasing, you have to at least double track the sound or even quad track it. On top of that, you need to cut the Gain almost in half on each guitar and add a OD with almost no distortion and use just as a boost so the tone can stay articulate and tight and not get muddied or washed out. And then let the bass track fill in the missing lower frequencies and oomph.

The FRFR kinda gets me that punch. I know 2x12 is not gonna give me the same punch as a 4x12. Of course. But as soon as I (in the cabinet setting) go from FRFR to the imprints, everything just goes weak. As someone here mentioned the Oxford imprint is probably the better solution. It’s not as weak as the others. Going back to the FRFR the punch comes back instantaneously. It might be a question of eq.

Quote from tamagotchi666

I think you should read the manual starting from page 87, especially page 107. Everything is explained quite well there. I certainly couldn’t explain it any better.

https://www.kemper-amps.com/downloads/5/User-Manuals

Page 87: stack

Page 107: acoustic simulator.

I kinda think, that this will be of no help to me .

To be serious. I have read the manual several times. To me things are not very clear. That’s why I ask here.

You see, I’m educated in philosophy and we’re kinda being taught from the get go, that it is very unnecessary to present complicated information in a difficult way.

When presenting technical information, why make it anymore complicated, than it should be? Kemper (and many other companies) fail - imho - in this regard.

Write in layman terms. Make it simple. Make it impossible to not understand. I really don’t get, why these companies don’t hire people who can do this.

But, that doesn’t mean, it’s not just me, who is stupid. That’s quite possibly true. A Kemper is in many cases not a simple device. I might just be too stupid to actually understand. That’s definitely a possibility.

I am currently working on, what I'm actually doing, since this is very confusing to me. But as far as I know/experience, then IR or the rigs own cab has a far punchier sound. At least I think, that this is my experience.

What I've done:

1) Went to the Output page.

2) Turned ON Kemper Kone and turned ON cabinet off.

That opens up "Imprint Select" in the cabinet section,

3) I try the different imprints. But going from FRFR to the imprints is just a very "sad" experience. All punch and power vanishes in an instant.

The problem is (I've now found out), that I'm not sure about, what the whole deal is with the two possibilities with cab ON/OFF is doing. There is a possibility to turn ON/OFF the cab in two places in the Output Page: Namely the "Monitor Out" and the "Kemper Kone".

Quote from Wheresthedug

I can understand the confusion but I think it actually much simpler that you realise.

1 - Kone mode On/OFF

If the Kone mode is ON the KPA applies a DSP eq curve (it’s probably more complex than that but this should be enough to visualise what is going on) which compensates for the speaker’s own curve and effectively gives a flat response blank canvas for other things to sit on.

Kone mode is OFF then no DSP is applied and you get the natural tone of the speaker in use. If this is. Kone then it will be flattish but not flat. If it is something other than a Kone it will be an unknown quantity.

2 - Monitor Cab Off ON/OFF

If ON (double negative so monitor cab is OFF) then you get imprints

If OFF then cab block is active so you get Full Range.

Display More

That got me a bit closer actually. I thought that the Kone had something to do with the imprints. I guess, that I have learned a valuable lesson here, that the Kone and the imprints are non-related, kinda.

Regarding the monitor cab on/off: You mean in the output page on the setting for "Monitor Out"? Enabled or not. Or do you mean ON/OFF in the "Monitor Out" and ON/OFF in the "Kemper Kone"? There are these two places for the cab ON/OFF. How does these two affect each other? It's find it pretty difficult to comprehend.

A completely secondary question: If wanting to have imprints on 1 rig and IR on another rig, how do I go about that? I thought that I had that down. Apparently I didn't.

Quote from BuckeyeBrown

I have a couple questions/seeking confirmations.

From Rig Manager Output Settings I've listed 4 combinations. I believe I understand what the first two do but I don't know about the last two.

• Kemper Kone Enabled + Cabinet Off Enabled = Select from available Speaker Imprints = Amp in the room type of sound
• Kemper Kone Enabled + Cabinet Off Disabled = Profiled Speaker/Cab is heard = Amp in the room type of sound
• Kemper Kone Disabled + Cabinet Off Enabled = Pretty sure this is FRFR Mode - Much brighter. Surely harsh at high volumes but I really like it at lower volumes
• Kemper Kone Disabled + Cabinet Off Disabled = ??? Pretty Dark/not sure what this would be

Any help is appreciated.

I find it really confusing to be honest. When on the output page, you have the following two "settings lines" to adjust.

1) Kemper Kone: This must be the "settings line" in the output page BuckeyeBrown refers to, right?

2) The Monitor Out: But what about the "cab off" possibility here? How does this affect the "Kemper Kone settings line" above (or the other way around)?

On top of that then you also have the cabinet settings, where you also can switch between the different imprints. If I want to be able to have access to the FRFR or Global Imprints in the "Imprint select" in the cabinet setting, then the "Kemper Kone" and "Cabinet off" needs to be enabled on the "Kemper Kone line" in the output page.

Is it only me, who feel very stupid? I have no clue how all this works and affect each other. I feel that this is way too complicated. I really need more simple explanations like BuckeyeBrown here is doing.

I don’t think the problem is tone. I done hate the tone. It’s just that the tone is lacking punch/power as soon as I switch imprints on. I could hear the exact same thing on Ola’s video. So why is that?