Bass Volumes

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    ☑️ Profiler Head/Rack

    Hi all,

    I recently bought a Bass (I'm normally a guitar player) and am having some trouble making it loud enough. Queue all the jokes about being a bass player...
    But since I'm playing by myself, I'd like to be loud enough.

    My input settings seem OK, since I see roughly the right levels in my DAW.

    As far as I understand and from what I see in my DAW, raising either the rig volume or the amp volume results in clipping of the output.
    I also tried raising the headphone volume and turning down the DAW volume in the output section. This achieves what I want, but how do I make this work with my other performances?

    As far as I can make out, the output presets only save what is active/inactive and not the actual levels. This is problematic since my levels work for the guitar performances. Also, it doesn't seem that you can assign the output a preset for each rig, the way it works with the input section, so I'd have to manually switch it every time I switch between bass and guitar.

    What did I miss? How can I set it up, so my bass can sound loud, without clipping?

    It all starts with finding a good profile, followed by using the studio equalizer in the “X” slot. Cut low freq around 40 hz, notch (cut) at around 60-80 hz, boost at around 100 hz, wide cut slightly at around 300-400 hz, slight boost at around 5 khz, and cut high freq at 7-8 khz. A compressor in the A-D slots is also recommended for bass.

    Quote from carloswalter

    It all starts with finding a good profile

    Any you can recommend? I'm trying to work with free profiles for now.

    I tried what you suggested
    The compressor affects output volume and can push the rig into clipping, so I'd have to reduce volume to avoid clipping.
    The EQ thing is great, I'll add that to the profiles I found so far.

    Thanks a bunch!

    Kemper has a few free profiles called "Tech Twenty-One Brass Diver DI". I paired these with a free "ampeg410bassIR" that I found online and sounds pretty decent. Using the DI profile by itself (no IR) also sounds nice.

    Also, I'm a guitar player, not a bass player, there may be better recommendations out there. :)

    I'll check those out. There are a lot of good ones in the kemper bass profile pack. I'm just in the process of adding stomps to them and so far I really like the variety.

    Anyway, my main problem isn't solved yet: How can I make these louder without clipping?

    Do I seriously have to write down all my levels and adjust, when I switch?

    Needless to say, all my rig and volumes are maxed out wrt clipping...

    Use a compressor to increase volume without clipping. Compression will also allow your mids to be heard against the lows so finger-plucks, slapping, and pick attack will be more pronounced.

    Larry Mar @ Lonegun Studios. Neither one famous yet.

    I would be wary of adding "EQ presets" to anything as a matter of course. Do they fit your particular bass? Playing style? Your selected profile? Your guitar tones? All this must be judged on a case-by-case basis.

    You don't write whether you're monitoring from an external interface, or using your Kemper directly, so it's hard to say what you should turn up or down. I'm also not clear on whether it is an issue during recording or playback, or both.

    Another possible issue could be your monitoring. I guess you monitor on headphones - can they sufficiently reproduce the bass frequencies?

    One thing to keep in mind is that the bass (obviously) has more low-end, which is more powerfull with regards to clipping - those low frequencies carry more energy.

    My first suggestion would be to increase your monitoring volume, not the rig volume. It might be that your guitars and other tracks in your DAW are simply too hot, and you try to compete with them by turning up the bass track as well. Try pulling down your other tracks and see if that gives you what you want.

    A compressor will likely help if it's a matter of the notes dying off to quickly - a compressor can help with the sustain. Of course it needs to be dialed in for this purpose.

    Finally, it might be that your guitar tracks are too low-end heavy as well, masking the bas.

    There are probably other things that could be tried, but I'll stop here :)

    Thanks, Michael, I'll try to be more precise.

    I am using the Kemper as an audio interface both for playing along to spotify and for recording. The issue is purely with playback, though. I know how to level DI and rig signals for recording. My problem is with hearing the bass in the mix. The DAW and spotify volumes are roughly the same. I can hear my guitar tone through that with no problem, but the bass tones don't seem to be loud enough.

    I play this through either my shure SE425 or headrush 112 FRFR. Surelye not designed for low end oomph, but should be good enough to hear it. The loudness problem is also present across the entire fretboard.

    I'll try your suggestions, but I have a question: Shouldn't I set up the level of my rig, so it's at -6 dB in the DAW? So if both signals are set up for that, I'd expect the bass to be roughly the same volume on the monitor, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

    I think -6 per track in the DAW is probably way too high. I would shoot for maybe -12 dB for all recorded tracks. No rules as such, but you're not achieving what you want - so I'd start there. And then turn up the bass track in the DAW after recording, so the levels of the individual tracks play nice with each other.

    You can achieve the same thing by turning the other tracks down after recording, of course. It's just more convenient the other way around.

    There's nothing to say that when each profile hits the same output (while recording) you don't have work to do with the faders in the DAW :-). That's part of mixing.

    I wouldn't compare spotify with the DAW output. Spotify tracks have been both mixed and mastered, so it's not really a valid comparison.

    Quote from jak888


    Needless to say, all my rig and volumes are maxed out wrt clipping...

    Just to clarify; are you saying that all your guitar rigs are boosted with amp volume and/or rig volume considerably above 0 in order to push the output closer to clipping without going over?

    If that is the case you need to turn DOWN all the guitar rigs not boost the bass rigs. There should be no need to run the output close to clipping.

    Quote from Wheresthedug

    Just to clarify; are you saying that all your guitar rigs are boosted with amp volume and/or rig volume considerably above 0 in order to push the output closer to clipping without going over?

    Sorry that I wasn't clearer! I meant, when I check the levels in the DAW they are at -6 dB, so turning up Rig Volume won't help, as that will put the output above that and will cause clipping.
    When I said "maxed out" I meant that they are using the dynamic range they have.

    Overall, it sounds fine if I set up the levels in the output section for each instrument. I'd just like to understand why there's such a dramatic drop-off between them. Plus, I'd like to avoid having to dial in the output section every time.

    Quote from jak888


    I'll try your suggestions, but I have a question: Shouldn't I set up the level of my rig, so it's at -6 dB in the DAW? So if both signals are set up for that, I'd expect the bass to be roughly the same volume on the monitor, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

    I went back and reread all the comments in the thread and noticed this one in particular. Instead of measuring peak levels try loading a Loudness Meter in the DAW and compare the LUFS values. LUFS measures perceived volume which is frequency specific.

    Also, the level going into your DAW isn’t critical. You want a good strong signal to avoid background noise/hiss (however this is almost a non issue in the digital domain compared to the old days of analog tape) without clipping. That gives you a pretty wide ranfe to work with. Once recorded rais and lower individual track levels and/or EQ to tase. At that stage you are “mixing” and every single case is different.